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Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.

They are praising Judd and hyping up snooker. Look at some old matches and you will see with your own eyes that it is not true. Not true at all. I'm done with this now. Go watch Ronnie in 2004, the 2005 Masters final, prime Hendry, prime Higgins... Watch the Charity final between Hendry and Ronnie... You will see it with your own eyes.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Ace

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.

They are praising Judd and hyping up snooker. Look at some old matches and you will see with your own eyes that it is not true. Not true at all. I'm done with this now. Go watch Ronnie in 2004, the 2005 Masters final, prime Hendry, prime Higgins... Watch the Charity final between Hendry and Ronnie... You will see it with your own eyes.


Ok friend it was fun debating with you. I will see you in the future.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Cloud Strife

Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.


Instead taking the word of all these pundits (whose job it is to hype things up to the nth degree by the way) as gospel, why don't you use your own eyes and judge for yourself? There are plenty of Higgins, Hendry and Ronnie matches on YouTube. Go on, go take a look, it's not difficult.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Ace

Cloud Strife wrote:
Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.


Instead taking the word of all these pundits (whose job it is to hype things up to the nth degree by the way) as gospel, why don't you use your own eyes and judge for yourself? There are plenty of Higgins, Hendry and Ronnie matches on YouTube. Go on, go take a look, it's not difficult.


I have and I said none of them faced an opponent on the same level of Higgins who who also playing well. I know Ronnie was great against Hendry in 2004 but Hendry didn't play as well as Higgins, surely you can see and Higgins is a much tougher opponent than Hawkins or do you think Hawkins is tougher than Higgins?

It's the fact that Judd did it against a 4x WC champion and someone who reached 3 finals in a row plus his nemesis. Dott was in his first ever wc final and lack of experience.

If Ronnie produced 7 centuries and 15+ breaks over 50 vs Hendry then I would have no problem. But doing it against John Higgins adds more gravitas as Ronnie would tell you himself.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Ace

Ash147 wrote:Judd is the best player in the game right now. There's a lot of people on this site who are crying because of that.


I agree nice to see another Judd fan. I can't wait for next season to see what Judd has in store now that the chains are off! He could do so much now with the monkey off his back and play snooker with so much freedom.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Cloud Strife

Ash147 wrote:Judd is the best player in the game right now. There's a lot of people on this site who are crying because of that.


Nobody's crying mate. And I don't know about anybody else, but I personally don't have any problems with saying Trump is the best player in the world at this moment in time. He has proved it in the biggest events so fair play to him for that. You won't hear any arguments from me.

What I do have an issue with is the hype and the over-the-top hyperbole.
Last edited by Cloud Strife on 10 May 2019, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Ace wrote:I have and I said none of them faced an opponent on the same level of Higgins .

Did Ronnie not beat a young prime Higgins (not old man Higgins) in the 2001 World final? Did Ronnie not beat prime Higgins with perfect snooker in the 2005 Masters final? Did Ronnie not win 36 ranking titles, while beating all the top players of the past 25 years? Did Ronnie not beat prime Hendry in two UK Championship finals? Did Ronnie not beat Mark Selby in two Masters finals? Did a 40-plus-year-old Ronnie not just beat Judd in a best of 19 just a while ago?

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Sickpotter

Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.


They are all hyping up the game and Judd as he's the new generation exciting player.

Judd played great in the final and deserved to win but I wouldn't say it was a better standard than we've seen before.

Higgins had a woeful season and while he produced patches of brilliance at the WC, he broke down on clearances far more than a prime Higgins ever would. Those clearances that Higgins is usually so good at (and which apply so much pressure to his opponent) were mostly absent from the final. IMO we got flashes of Johns B game but mostly his C game while Judd was definitely on his A game.

For the record I think Judd would've lost in every one of those proposed match ups by about the same margin.....18 (Hendry/ROS/Higgins) - 12 2019 Judd

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Cloud Strife

Ace wrote:
Ash147 wrote:Judd is the best player in the game right now. There's a lot of people on this site who are crying because of that.


I agree nice to see another Judd fan. I can't wait for next season to see what Judd has in store now that the chains are off! He could do so much now with the monkey off his back and play snooker with so much freedom.


Yeah, next season will be an intriguing one. Be very interesting to see how Judd deals with being the main man now and having a target on his back.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Cloud Strife wrote:
Ash147 wrote:Judd is the best player in the game right now. There's a lot of people on this site who are crying because of that.


Nobody's crying mate. And I don't know about anybody else, but I personally don't have any problems with saying Trump is the best player world at this moment in time. He has proved it in the biggest events so fair play to him for that. You won't hear any arguments from me.

What I do have an issue with is the hype and the over-the-top hyperbole.

I agree. Being the best player at the moment is not the same as being better than prime Hendry, Higgins, and Ronnie. Not the same at all.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Cloud Strife

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Cloud Strife wrote:
Ash147 wrote:Judd is the best player in the game right now. There's a lot of people on this site who are crying because of that.


Nobody's crying mate. And I don't know about anybody else, but I personally don't have any problems with saying Trump is the best player world at this moment in time. He has proved it in the biggest events so fair play to him for that. You won't hear any arguments from me.

What I do have an issue with is the hype and the over-the-top hyperbole.

I agree. Being the best player at the moment is not the same as being better than prime Hendry, Higgins, and Ronnie. Not the same at all.


Exactly.

Take someone like Higgins for example, who is a shadow of the player he once was. No way would Judd have been able to do what he did to a prime version of Higgins. No way in a million years.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Sickpotter wrote:They are all hyping up the game and Judd as he's the new generation exciting player.

Judd played great in the final and deserved to win but I wouldn't say it was a better standard than we've seen before.

Higgins had a woeful season and while he produced patches of brilliance at the WC, he broke down on clearances far more than a prime Higgins ever would. Those clearances that Higgins is usually so good at (and which apply so much pressure to his opponent) were mostly absent from the final. IMO we got flashes of Johns B game but mostly his C game while Judd was definitely on his A game.

For the record I think Judd would've lost in every one of those proposed match ups by about the same margin.....18 (Hendry/ROS/Higgins) - 12 2019 Judd

Good post, Sickpotter! :spot on:

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Pink Ball

While I agree this is over the top, I think it’s good to see people so excited about a player other than Sullivan. I’m getting a lot of enthusiasm from otherwise once-a-year viewers who were energised by Trump’s display

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Pink Ball wrote:While I agree this is over the top, I think it’s good to see people so excited about a player other than Sullivan. I’m getting a lot of enthusiasm from otherwise once-a-year viewers who were energised by Trump’s display

That is great indeed. And that's why the pundits use all that hyperbole. It works. Good for the game.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Pink Ball

Sickpotter wrote:
Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.


They are all hyping up the game and Judd as he's the new generation exciting player.

Judd played great in the final and deserved to win but I wouldn't say it was a better standard than we've seen before.

Higgins had a woeful season and while he produced patches of brilliance at the WC, he broke down on clearances far more than a prime Higgins ever would. Those clearances that Higgins is usually so good at (and which apply so much pressure to his opponent) were mostly absent from the final. IMO we got flashes of Johns B game but mostly his C game while Judd was definitely on his A game.

For the record I think Judd would've lost in every one of those proposed match ups by about the same margin.....18 (Hendry/ROS/Higgins) - 12 2019 Judd

I actually don’t agree with that. I’m honestly not sure if I’ve seen a better performance in a world final. And I’ve seen the lot of em.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby SnookerFan

Badsnookerplayer wrote:I think Cloud Strife makes a good point

Rather than listen to pundits like O'Sullivan, Davis and Hendry you should listen to him and Holden.


To be fair, I find most posters on this forum better advised than the professional pundits. rofl

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:I think Cloud Strife makes a good point

Rather than listen to pundits like O'Sullivan, Davis and Hendry you should listen to him and Holden.

Finally a reasonable, non-passive aggressive post. Cheers BSP :hatoff:

Wildey, Iranu, Sickpotter, The Rocket and MDG, are also good to listen to, by the way.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby D4P

The 5 players that Judd Trump beat at the WC had played in a combined total of 2 finals this season and had won a combined total of 1 ranking event, and that 1 ranking event was the Shootout.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby SnookerFan

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:I think Cloud Strife makes a good point

Rather than listen to pundits like O'Sullivan, Davis and Hendry you should listen to him and Holden.

Finally a reasonable, non-passive aggressive post. Cheers BSP :hatoff:

Wildey, Iranu, Sickpotter, The Rocket and MDG, are also good to listen to, by the way.


And SnookerFan. :wave:

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

SnookerFan wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:I think Cloud Strife makes a good point

Rather than listen to pundits like O'Sullivan, Davis and Hendry you should listen to him and Holden.

Finally a reasonable, non-passive aggressive post. Cheers BSP :hatoff:

Wildey, Iranu, Sickpotter, The Rocket and MDG, are also good to listen to, by the way.


And SnookerFan. :wave:

:bowdown:

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Pink Ball

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:I think Cloud Strife makes a good point

Rather than listen to pundits like O'Sullivan, Davis and Hendry you should listen to him and Holden.

Finally a reasonable, non-passive aggressive post. Cheers BSP :hatoff:

Wildey, Iranu, Sickpotter, The Rocket and MDG, are also good to listen to, by the way.

And old Pinkey

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Holden Chinaski

Pink Ball wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:I think Cloud Strife makes a good point

Rather than listen to pundits like O'Sullivan, Davis and Hendry you should listen to him and Holden.

Finally a reasonable, non-passive aggressive post. Cheers BSP :hatoff:

Wildey, Iranu, Sickpotter, The Rocket and MDG, are also good to listen to, by the way.

And old Pinkey

He's OK for an Irishman.

Re: Judd Trump is snooker's greatest talent

Postby Ace

Sickpotter wrote:
Ace wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Ace wrote:Nothing wrong in thinking Judd has taken the game to a new level, .

The only thing wrong with it is that it's NOT TRUE. I wis it was true, it would be amazing to see a player play better snooker than prime Hendry, Ronnie, and Higgins did. I would love that. But I have never seen it.


Then why is everyone saying it's the best standard there's been? Ronnie himself said it's better than his own game and Hendry's and Higgins, Higgins said he hasn't seen a talent like it, Davis said he wouldn't want to play Judd in the final and never seen such ferocious snooker etc

Are they all lying just because it's about Judd? If it was about Ronnie I bet you wouldn't disagree.


They are all hyping up the game and Judd as he's the new generation exciting player.

Judd played great in the final and deserved to win but I wouldn't say it was a better standard than we've seen before.

Higgins had a woeful season and while he produced patches of brilliance at the WC, he broke down on clearances far more than a prime Higgins ever would. Those clearances that Higgins is usually so good at (and which apply so much pressure to his opponent) were mostly absent from the final. IMO we got flashes of Johns B game but mostly his C game while Judd was definitely on his A game.

For the record I think Judd would've lost in every one of those proposed match ups by about the same margin.....18 (Hendry/ROS/Higgins) - 12 2019 Judd


8 breaks over 50 and 4 centuries is John's C game now? Judd took time and the table away from him and didn't give him the chance to make more. Higgins said he was lucky to win 9 frames given the way Judd was playing. Yes he didn't have a good season but World champs is separate from the rest of the snooker season, you can win 0 tournaments in a season and still come to the world champs and win it we've seen plenty of times done by players.


   

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