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Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

SF is right, its a rankibg whether we like it or not, however, from a personal point of view, I shall never regard this as a ranking event title, so for me Ants is still on 1, same would go for Ronnie for that matter if he won this one, I certainly wouldnt class him as above Higgins and Davis on 29.

It used to be fub event, but this year things made a nasty turn.

Incidents like the Gilbert one should be avoided at all costs. Maybe the ref couldnt hear the clock, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but I think theres a sreen with the time left, so he should have had a look at it. At least Xiao didnt win the title, but I would have loves if he did, just to create more controversy.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby SnookerFan

Hearn will keep on making this a ranking event. He's too stubborn to change his mind.

He sees everybody, players included, saying what a bad idea this is as a success. If people are talking about it, it's a success.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby PoolBoy

I didn't really enjoy this tournament very much at all.
The crowd involvement just started to be annoying - that 'yellow' nonsense soon became SO irritating!

I didn't see any of the first two days, but from what I saw over the weekend, it did look like the players were taking it a bit more 'seriously' than in previous editions?

As already mentioned, kudos to Anthony McGill for saying it as-it-is regarding the ridiculous ranking event status for this tournament.
it's easy to say if you've been knocked-out in the first round - but, after winning it and benefiting hugely from it in the rankings, makes his comment hold much more weight.

Meanwhile, proper snooker returns today, in the shape of Championship League!

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby SnookerFan

PoolBoy wrote:Meanwhile, proper snooker returns today, in the shape of Championship League!


Never did we think we'd see the day that the Championship League was considered proper snooker.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Lucky

SnookerFan wrote:
Lucky wrote:World Snooker rankings beg to differ. I don't know if demented ramblings by 3 or 4 posters on a snooker forum undermine this fact though.


Three or Four posters on an internet forum?

The guy who won it said it shouldn't be a ranking event. Or are his ramblings demented, as well?





Biggest idiot out of them all. Anyone who partakes in something, benefits out of it, then moans is an absolute cockerel ring.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby SnookerFan

Lucky wrote:Biggest idiot out of them all. Anyone who partakes in something, benefits out of it, then moans is an absolute cockerel ring.


How is he a cockerel ring?

Surely, that's as effective a stance as you're going to get?

Somebody who got knocked out in the first round and moaned, everybody would say it was sour grapes. Somebody winning it, and still staying it was a bad idea can't be a bad thing, can it?

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby The Herminator

Maybe it seems like we've been banging on about it but for me this tournament has been a red flag. It shows exactly where Hearn is prepared to go. I can take or leave the music and the lights, that doesn't bother me. And I believe there is a space for fun tournaments with rule changes like shot clocks, etc. that can live alongside the "proper" tournaments (just like test and 20/20 cricket). However, by making this a ranker Hearn has blurred that distinction. It means nothing is off limits even to how the game is played. He wants to use the ranking system as a way to force the big boys to take part in any tin pot tournament he can think up (as it happens it didn't work in this case). But it's a warning sign.

Fortunately most of the players (Shaun Murphy aside) agree with most of us, but how much leverage that has with Hearn I don't know. We must do our best to make sure that in the process of modernizing the game we don't sacrifice the things that made us fall in love with it in the first place.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Iranu

The worst thing about this being a ranking event is that the quality of play was, generally, absolutely bucking shocking.

No century break the entire week, right? Well, that's what happens when players or put under unnecessary pressure (in terms of both shot clock and ranking points).

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Cloud Strife

SnookerFan wrote:
Lucky wrote:Biggest idiot out of them all. Anyone who partakes in something, benefits out of it, then moans is an absolute cockerel ring.


How is he a cockerel ring?

Surely, that's as effective a stance as you're going to get?

Somebody who got knocked out in the first round and moaned, everybody would say it was sour grapes. Somebody winning it, and still staying it was a bad idea can't be a bad thing, can it?


He's being a hypocrite, that's the point.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby SnookerFan

Cloud Strife wrote:
He's being a hypocrite, that's the point.


I don't see it.

He's not being dishonest with it. He said he was happy to have the benefits, but even he thinks it's a bad idea.

Seems like he is calling it pretty straight.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby SnookerFan

TWITTER ATTACK!

Matthew Selt @MattSelt
That's just cost Gilbert 14k and a spot in the tour champs!! Ridiculous I'm afraid

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby KrazeeEyezKilla

McGill didn't make a big fuss or go on a rant, he just said that he didn't think it should be a ranking tournament. I presume he played in it every previous year and has no problem with the event itself.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

Said many times, the event itself isn't bad, not proper Snooker but a fun event nevertheless, at least that was the case until this year. The irony being this now being a ranking event saw the quality of play down the toilet, not to mention Hearn's attempet at the top boys entering didnt exactly work, with some of them not taking part, and I'm happy they didn't.

McGill said it as he sees it, he won it, yet still made a comment like that. Sure, he now benefits from the ranking money, but the point here is he still said it shouldnt be a ranker, so if his money were to be taken off I'd say he wouldn't mind, given he entered he every edition (I think) and was just here for the fun.

Hearn will never make this a non.ranker now, and as SF so rightly said, Hearn's main job is to make people talking, whether its the most stupiest ideia of all. The 1 million was also a bullocks talking point after Wenbo got knocked out, and this is similar. The whole world can be against him, but as long as it keeps people talking, he's done a good job lol...

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

It was thanks to Hearn that the game came back from the dead, and thank God for that.

But in the last few years, the first coming with the crap UK format, the endless Best of 7s and now this being a ranker, I think maybe the game should be handed to another person to run it now?

At least that's what I would like. Hearn has done most of what he promissed, not it's time for him to leave the game and another chairman emend some of the ridiculous things he's done in the last 2 or 3 years.

Sadly, Hearn will still be around for a few more years. I just hope he brings more good than bad in the future.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

The Herminator wrote: We must do our best to make sure that in the process of modernizing the game we don't sacrifice the things that made us fall in love with it in the first place.


You said it all there :hatoff:

Make the UK 32 man field again with Best of 17s at the venue, reduce the Best of 7s, and make the Shoot-Out a non-ranker. Only a dream I'm afraid :shrug:

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Dan-cat

The reason that snooker is doing so well, with massively increased amount of tournaments and prize money, is because of the changes he's made, whether we like them or not.

Handing it to someone else at this point would be business suicide.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby SnookerFan

Dan-cat wrote:The reason that snooker is doing so well, with massively increased amount of tournaments and prize money, is because of the changes he's made, whether we like them or not.

Handing it to someone else at this point would be business suicide.


Yeah, I wouldn't go as far as crying Sack Hearn.

But this really is a baffling decision.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

One positive is Shaun Murphy didn't win this event <ok>

Had he won we wouldn't hear the end of it, him licking Hearn's jacksie and how great this now being a ranker is <doh>

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby KrazeeEyezKilla

Hearn is a bit out of his comfort zone with Snooker, Darts and Boxing (and pro-wrestling) are more suited to his promotional style as you can fill big venues with hyped up crowds and entrances. He ditched Betfred as World Championship sponsor five years ago for a "blue chip" company but eventually had to go back as none were interested. Even the very pro-Hearn Dave Hendon said at the time that events like the Shootout aren't exactly helping with Snooker image.

Right now betting companies are where the money is so it makes sense to go with them but that mightn't be the case in the future although given that Hearn is 68 you don't know how long he will keep going for, although he looks the type who will never retire.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby KrazeeEyezKilla

If Hearn was to be replaced there's only one choice to replace him.

1) Replace Hearn with an established snooker heavyweight like Dennis Taylor, John Parrott, Jimmy White or Ken Doherty — someone who understands the game deeply from a player’s perspective, can be trusted to act in its long-term interest, and has a modern, international perspective that it now so desperately needs.


According to this.

https://medium.com/@IdeasRoadshow/fixin ... .uyfrqng57

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

KrazeeEyezKilla wrote:If Hearn was to be replaced there's only one choice to replace him.

1) Replace Hearn with an established snooker heavyweight like Dennis Taylor, John Parrott, Jimmy White or Ken Doherty — someone who understands the game deeply from a player’s perspective, can be trusted to act in its long-term interest, and has a modern, international perspective that it now so desperately needs.


According to this.

https://medium.com/@IdeasRoadshow/fixin ... .uyfrqng57


If DT was to run Snooker he would somehow find a way to have one more tournaments being played on a Golf course pmsl

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby eraserhead

Well done Ants :hatoff:

The bar for a ranking event is set now. You could make the championship league a ranker and you'd think at least it's better than the shoot out. We've seen how rare best of 9's whole tournament have become. Could best of 5's and 3's start popping up?

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Iranu

eraserhead wrote:Well done Ants :hatoff:

The bar for a ranking event is set now. You could make the championship league a ranker and you'd think at least it's better than the shoot out. We've seen how rare best of 9's whole tournament have become. Could best of 5's and 3's start popping up?


Hell, even one complete frame per match would be a step up.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Iranu

Cloud Strife wrote:
SnookerFan wrote:
Lucky wrote:Biggest idiot out of them all. Anyone who partakes in something, benefits out of it, then moans is an absolute cockerel ring.


How is he a cockerel ring?

Surely, that's as effective a stance as you're going to get?

Somebody who got knocked out in the first round and moaned, everybody would say it was sour grapes. Somebody winning it, and still staying it was a bad idea can't be a bad thing, can it?


He's being a hypocrite, that's the point.

I don't think the two things are mutually exclusive.

It's possible to disagree with something but still partake in it. Especially if the outlook of your livelihood depends on it so much.

The top players have the luxury of 'boycotting' events they don't like, not everyone is so lucky. And I don't believe for a second that any of those players decided not to turn up because they wanted to boycott the event. It just wasn't worth their time. For others, including McGill, it was. He was quite up front about being happy to accept the benefits.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby eraserhead

how many frame winning breaks where made this year?

I didn't watch any of this this year but when I've watched in previous years it usually winds up with people playing to the clock and you see some very negative snooker.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Andre147

eraserhead wrote:how many frame winning breaks where made this year?

I didn't watch any of this this year but when I've watched in previous years it usually winds up with people playing to the clock and you see some very negative snooker.


This year was an all time low on quality. In previous Shoot-Out editions at least you saw some centuries and some frame winning breaks, 70s and 80s.

This year I can count on just 1 hand the frame winning breaks that were made, and to highlight the bad quality, the 128 man field meant there were double the matches played, yet the quality managed to be even way worst.

I can also see in the future Best of 5 or even Best of 3 ranking tournaments.

Best of 5 wouldn't be anything new in fact, most will remember the World Open in 2010, only the Final was Best of 9. Actually, come to think of it, I'm surprised there's only been one Best of 5 ranker since that one.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby Pink Ball

I remember they had a best-of-3 ranking event a few years ago and it was actually excellent entertainment. Also, the best players were consistently coming out on top because the matches were under the cosh from the start. It was good as a stand-alone event, obviously wouldn't be pushing for it to become the norm like best-of-7s have.

Re: Coral Snooker Shoot Out!!!

Postby eraserhead

It's such a strange event because it's supposed to be something that encourages fast attacking play yet you see players slowing down routine shots because it has value. Is the appeal of going to the shootout live just to shout YEELOOOOOOW or whatever colour the crowds excited about this year.